EFT Lawful Actions – Fred & Nina Show On the Road

2012, Current Events, Inspirational, Money 9 Comments

Robert Hender ' R J '

Sat, Feb 18, 2012

Subject: EFT's Work – Foreclosures, IRS Issues, Title 42 Training Oh My


EFT Bank Secret Transfers  
Electronic Forclosure Saves – Lawful UCC EFT's  
People have a right to know these EFT Secrets.  Do you know someone who  gets money every month that is wired directly to their bank?  EFT's are done by the banks, every day.  As a reporter and a commentator when I learned this then I knew I must help share this EFT intel with my audience.  Donate $50 to Fred and Nina at www.SetOffDebt.com  and begin learning with Fred's CD with docs and a video.  Donate $150 to Fred and Nina and get a Video Set of a 3-Day Seminar.  Make sure that you attend one of Fred and Nina's Seminars, face to face.  Organize a Fred and Nina Seminar in your town info@SetOffDebt.com .   Apply the intel Fred and Nina share to save your homes and property.  R J Hender needs donations to, to help get this word out to Americans…  Robert Hender P O Box 192 Manti, UT  84642  If you have a PayPal account then you can donate funds to ' R J ' at Cogo_03@yahoo.com
Fred Gutierrez told me last November that God wanted me in California to learn about EFT's from him and Nina, face to face.  I report and comment on issues that most media people are afraid to approach.  The ' Main Press, ' ignores this intel so I do my Radio Work and Website work every weekday with Faith and Prayers that God will lead and provide for me.  How could Fred be so bold to tell me that God wanted  me in California at a Fred and Nina 1Day class on the 17th of December.  I have no  car and I get no paycheck, so I put off my commitment… 
For you, it is important that you to go to www.SetOffDebt.com to see when Fred and Nina may bring a Seminar near you.  Fred and Nina teach EFT details and Affidavit Writing and Title 42 actions that allow us to defend ourselves.  Many of us  have had no experience Standing Up for ourselves, in this way.  Fred and Nina are asked by hundreds and thousands of people to do the Discharge Work for them but there are only 24 hours in a day.  There is not enough Fred and Nina to go around.  If a million Americans learned how to Discharge Debts like this and learned how to Stand up for the Constitution we could turn America around.   
On Dec 15th last year I finally made a promise to God that I would go to California if God would provide a way for me to go.  Fred did promise me that he would put me up in a Motel in California, if I went.  Well, I finally made a promise to God that if He wanted me to go then He would have to provide me a way to go.  Wow, the next day I got a phone call from somebody 45 miles away and they asked me if I was going to California for this Fred and Nina Seminar on the 17th of December.  I told them that I had no car, but I was willing to go.  I didn't tell anyone else that I made this promise to God, just the day before. 
These neighbors borrowed a car and they drove me to California and boy, was I thankful that they brought me to see Fred and Nina, in person.  This is the best way to learn what Fred and Nina Gutierrez have to share.  I learned a lot from Fred and Nina at that Seminar in California.  I met other Patriot friends who are using the EFT intel from these classes and they are saving homes from foreclosures, they are being successful against IRS issues and they are learning how to hold Judges and Lawyers to their oaths of office. 
Fred made me a promise, that he would put me up while I was in California.  Well, Fred was late in catching his plane from Hawaii and he was not able to get to Cal in time to help me with my shelter or food needs.  God took care of it, by other people who saw I needed a place to stay and food for my trip to this Fred and Nina event.
I never made an issue out of what appeared to be Fred's broken promise.  I didn't go for Fred.  I made a promise to God that if He wanted me there then He would have to provide a way and God is faithful.  Fred did not break his promise, but conditions arrised he could not control.  All of us have situations that show up that we never expected.  I was in God's hands.  God is Faithful.    
Fred Gutierrez made me another promise.  Fred told me that if I could bring 50 people or more together near Salt Lake then he would come and share their intel with people in my part of the country.  With my Fred and Nina articles on this web- site and from my radio program and by email and phone I have helped to send more than 3,000 people to Fred and Nina's website and seminars.  www.SetOffDebt.com  In Utah we set the 27th of January for the day when Fred and Nina would come to Provo to teach people here.  For about 3 months I have been telling people about Fred and Nina's Seminars.  For a month I made phone calls, sent emails, wrote articles on this website and I spoke on my radio program to bring attention to the Utah Fred and Nina Seminar.  Fred told me that people would pay just $25 for the 1-Day Seminar on the 27th.  Then I heard that Fred and Nina were willing to spend 2-Days more to teach people more intel.  The 2-Day Jan 28th and Jan 29th Court-Room Boot Camp would cost people $195 more.  Other Patriot Seminars cost much more, by other so-called Gu-Ru's. 
  1. I secured a TV Studio to hold the 3 Day Fred and Nina Seminar in Utah  RockCanyonStudios.com  
  2. I negotiated a fee of just $100 for Fri and $100 for Sat and $100 for Sunday for the main studio
  3. I negotiated For Free the video taping of all 3 – Days of the Utah Seminar  Fred told me this was okay – to set up the Video Recording and they would work out the terms later with Gaynor Brunson
  4. I had commitments for 80 people to attend this Utah Fred and Nina Seminar
  5. I negotiated a Sharing of all Video Sales between Fred and Nina and the Gaynor Brunson. 
  6. Fred supplied me with some of his CD's with docs and a video – I gave most of them away as I gave them away to Gaynor and other people who promised radio interview time to get the word out…
  7. I never asked Fred to put me up in a hotel for this Utah Seminar.   I live 2 hours away from the event. A patriot neighbor made sure that I had a ride to the Brunson Studios.
  8. I didn't ask for a financial share in the Seminar Fees or the Video Tape sales   Never before has Fred and Nina been recorded on TV quality cameras, with pro lighting and pro audio for their Seminar.  Money was never why I organized this event in Utah.  Gaynor Brunson was happy to offer his Studios so  people could learn this intel.  Usually Gaynor charges at least $400 an hour for their Main Stage.  . Gaynor Brunson was promised a share in the Video Tape Sales that would be sold from this Utah event.  We had 3 cameramen working the event.  Fred and Nina's people took over other Rooms at Gaynor Brunson's facility. If Gaynor Brunson was paid, what he usually charges our costs would have been over $14,600  Gaynor Brunson expected to share in the sales of the Video Tape sets that would be produced and sold from the Utah event.  Gaynor's people are ready to edit and fulfill orders for the 3-Days of Videos.
I blame assumptions and a lack of communication for any conflict that has come since the Utah Seminar on the 27th, 28th and 29th of January.  Never before has Fred and Nina been recorded in a professional TV studio, with pro cameras, pro lighting and pro sound in a studio setting.  I set all of this up, with no thought of what is in it for me.   
Many of you may not be able to travel to a Fred and Nina seminar.  On the morning of the 27th of January Kelby announced that a Video Tape Set of the Utah Seminar would be available for people to buy at just $150 a set.  Without my knowledge Kelby told the owner of the Brunson Studios that he would pay them $2,000 for their efforts to video record the seminar.  Kelby begain taking money from people for these Video Sets from Utah.  People at the Seminar were excited that they could share this Fred and Nina footage with their friends at home so they paid $150 more for the promised Utah Video Set, while they were at Gaynor Brunson's Studio.
What if 1,000 people buy thest Utah Seminar Videos?  Is that $150,000 for them?  What if the 3,000 people that I have sent to Fred and Nina's site buy these 3-Day Video Sets from the Utah Seminar?  Would that be $450,000?  Where is Gaynor Brunson's share, that I negotiated, with the Okay of fred Gutierrez.  Why did Kelby negotiate a new deal  behind my back with Gaynor Brunson that has left the Utah Footage in the can, un edited. They decided to pay Gaynor $2,000 and then they are giving people a Video Set from Arizona, not the Utah Pro Video Sets that people have already paid for.  Gaynor Brunson and his people did the work, provided the services and kept their commitment.
I did ask the Brunson Studios to hang my banners in the studio.  I did not think they would be placed behind Fred and Nina.  If Fred and Nina did not want my banners hung behind them, on the stage then all they had to ask me to remove them.  I would have been glad to do so.  Much of the banners were hidden by their White Board and by Fred and Nina on stage.  There is the Republic for Utah banner and my Wheat Grass Banner that I wanted in the room, but they did not have to be hung behind the Main Stage. 
The day after the Utah Fred and Nina Seminar, I got an email from kelby saying that they would not be using any of the Video Footage that was shot in Utah, at the professional studios.  People have already paid for these 3-Day Utah Seminar videos.  Edit work for these videos would take about a week to do. 
So far, the people who came to the Utah Seminar have not received their Video Tapes. Kelby says that he will send them footage from the Arizona Fred and Nina Seminar. 
The intel that Fred and Nina have to share is outstanding.  I believe that people all over America need to drive, fly or swim to a Fred and Nina Seminar, ASAP. People need to know this intel.  Arizona Video Tapes with Fred and Nina would be just as good as a Video Tape Set from Arizona, except for the quality that people were expecting from the Gaynor Brunson Studios taping.
What I do not understand is why I have been thrown under the bus by people I thought were my friends.  On my Radio Program and from this Website and by emails I have been telling people about much of this intel for 3 months – even for years…    
Everywhere Fred and Nina go, they are surrounded by people who want and need their attention on Foreclosure and  IRS emergencies that need to be fixed.  Many people are timid to do the EFT work for themselves.  Fred and Nina teach people how to do the EFT and Standing Up in Court work for themselves.  By phone and by email and in person Fred and Nina are helping people early every day and as late as midnight and beyond.  Fred and Nina Gutierrez operate a Ministry – doing their best to help people and to teach people, but there is only so much of Fred and Nina to go around.
I wonder if Fred and Nina can deliver the Video Tapes people are paying for.  There are only so many hours in the day.  So far, nobody who attended the Utah Seminar has been given the Video Tapes they have already paid for.  People who attended the Utah event have been asking me where their Videos are.  It was me who set up the Utah Seminar.
This was an event that I spent a month – organizing and promoting.  I never asked to  be paid for this effort.  I have never demanded that I get paid for any of this work.  As I  observe how many people who have come to MorningLiberty.com and then gone to the Fred and Nina's website, I have sent over thousands of Americans their way.    
  1. People should attend a Fred and Nina Seminar in person  www.SetOffDebt.com 
  2. People need to buy a $150 3-Day Seminar Video Set to share the intel with friends 
  3. People need to receive buy Fred's $50 CD with powerful documents and a video
  4. In a timely manner buyers of the CD and Video Tapes need to be sent to customers.  
This article was written as my attempt to defend myself from accusations by people who are around Fred and Nina.
I pray that time will heal my broken heart for the poor tratment I have received.  I pray that Fred and Nina are protected and sustained by God so that they can continue delivering their message.  I pray that more Americans wake up and step up and participate in solving the attacks against our liberties. 
People need to learn what Fred and Nina have to share.  I pray that you will receive the CD's and the Videos that you may pay for…  Some people have been whining and complaining about how Fred and Nina's intel doesn't work.  The enemy to freedom is doing all they can do to put a stop to these remedies.  Some people aren't using Fred and Nina's intel correctly.  Blaming Fred and Nina won't solve a thing.  You and I have work to do.   
Be free…   Robert Hender…   R J…   P O Box 192  Manti,  UT  84642    God Bless   


Fred and Nina are not going to be using the video content from the UTAH recording.  We did not want to advertise with the banners in the back ground.  We made a mistake in letting them video and not getting the information clear as to what the fees would be in advance.  We agreed to 2000 for the room and video.  I wish we would have just paid the 300 and not paid for the camera stuff. 

I am discouraged by some of your actions in UTAH.  Meaning, putting Fred on the line (at the event, not prior discussed) to pay for your room and food.  Bottom line is you are a really good guy and in a very bad spot.  Fred should not have been asked to handle a hotel and food for you.  You should have requested this in advance, rather then letting Fred to get there and then assume that he was responsible. 

RJ, you are appreciated much, but your approach on financial issues is less then desirable.  Clarity in advance would be appreciated.  Getting permission for banners, allowing for the owners brother to come in for free whom then started asking questions which seemed to be challenging Fred on the stage. 

The event overall was great.  I am encouraged by the people and what they are doing.  Let’s continue forward with clarity on our responsibilities. 

Republic Leadership, Fred and Nina, and UTAH Seminar Participants,



RJ Hender is selling Fred and Nina Gutierrez private Advance and Basic Seminar on his website without contract or verbal permission.  RJ Hender was helpful in setting up the meeting in UTAH.  For helping with the seminar, he was given $50 in cash for food, the entire weekend for free, and we paid for his hotel.  RJ asked me if Gaynor Brunson could film it and have a contract with Fred and Nina to sell the videos at some point in the future.  Fred and Nina decided not to use that video because RJ and put his private advertisements up on the back of the stage without consent.  We were told that we were going to pay 100 per day.  When we arrived at the seminar they had already set up cameras to record the event.  We didn’t know or have anything agreed to at that point with or for the filming cost.  The location was a great environment and setting for the seminar.  Gaynor seemed very helpful and opened his home office to us.  At the end of the weekend, we met with Gaynor (Studio owner) and talked about the cost to get the data that they were filing and came to an agreement of $2000.00.  We paid him 1000 in asked told him that we would cover the balance in about a week.   In other words, we paid for the data.  It belongs to Fred and Nina Gutierrez.  Gaynor has been BCC’d on this email and we desire an invoice for the balance and it will be paid today.   

RJ has been asked by Fred Gutierrez directly to STOP selling his basic DVD’s earlier this week.  He was selling them on his website for $55.00 and it was without permission.  He then posted the one of the attached links yesterday advertising the Advance series of DVD’s for $150.00.  Unfortunately no matter how you slice it, this is a theft of funds and it will be addressed directly to all parties.  At this point, Gaynor is not a part of the theft of the DVD’s being sold.  RJ is however pointing on his website to go to Gaynor’s site and purchase and send the funds directly to Gaynor’s place of business.  This is very disheartening to say the least.   We can NOT find any mention of the DVD’s on Gaynor’s website.  We trusted RJ and Gaynor and there is NO reason for this behavior from RJ. 

All UTAH participants will receive the Advance series DVD very soon.  It is being edited as we speak.  The filming was done at the Arizona seminar and it was excellent.  Talk with your Arizona colleges.  They will tell you that your video is going to be great.  RJ has nothing to do with the fulfillment of the DVD’s, so please direct your questions that you may have to info@setoffdebt.com.  We have a team of people answering the thousands of inquires from www.setoffdebt.com.  

I am formally withdrawing any and all of my future commitment to appear on the radio on behalf of myself, the Republic, or Fred and Nina.  As promoter for Fred and Nina, I am giving formal demand to remove any mention of their names, DVD’s, or seminars from the website www.morningliberty.com or any site that RJ Hender may own.   To remove oneself from unnecessary litigation, they comply within 24 hours.





Related Articles:

End of the World for Debt – Standing in Honor with Fred & Nina

Top 6 Acts to Discharge Debts – EFT Secrets by Fred and Nina Gutierrez

Top 3 Discharge Debt Solutions – Time for Peaceful Action

Ron Paul Most Popular – Main Press Panic 2012

Economic Collapse – Morning Liberty Needs Help Too

Morning Liberty Radio Program – Moving to the Micro Effect



Read the "About RJ" page for more information.


  1. Danny Tapeta March 23, 2012 at 8:58 PM

    What is going on with the Fred Gutierrez issue? This doesn’t look good among Christians.

    • RJ March 24, 2012 at 12:50 AM

      From what I know, I think that Fred and Nina are honorable.

      I believe that i was thrown under the bus, for money. I think that people around Fred and Nina would not share in some of their proceeds. Gaynor Brunson has every right to share in the proceeds from the 3-day of video taping at his professional tv studios.

      Every month, I have no idea how my utilities will get paid. When I made all the arrangements for Fred and Nina to come to Utah, I didn’t do any of that for money. As it all came together, we realized how important the footage was for people who may never have the time or the means to travel to a Fred and Nina event.

      Fred told me to go ahead and make all the arrangements and do the negotiations. I did and then somebody else took it out of my hands. That party is burning his own bridges…

  2. John Gutierrez March 24, 2012 at 10:30 PM


    My professional expertise for years has been investigating fraud and corruption cases, then forwarding evidence to State AG’s and US Attorneys for criminal prosecution.

    Then again, you would know that if you had not disassociated from your family twenty-years ago without a word.

    The serious exchanges on this page tell an interesting story within the story, and something should be done about it.

    I’ll take a crack at it and accurately determine where the inducements, breach of contract, and forfeiture of future rights to legal redress lie through deception.

    We’ll be a step ahead of you from now on.

    Your Eldest Brother,

    • RJ March 25, 2012 at 12:54 AM

      Dear John,

      It matters to me, that people who have paid for a Video Tape set of Seminars with Fred and Nina, get what they paid for. According to reports today, video sets have arrived in the mail to people who paid for them several weeks ago. It appears that Fred and Nina are delivering the product to the people who have paid for them.

      You may call it entertainment or education, but I learned from Fred and Nina.

      At some Patriot Seminars people pay $500 or $1,000 or more for an education.

      I think lots of people are misusing some of the intel Fred and Nina teach. Some people misuse intel that they have learned from other sources.

      I have seen Fred and Nina work long, difficult hours advising people and helping people early in the mornings and late into the night…

      Along the way, with a lack of communication between siblings or patriots it’s too easy to find reasons to attack one another. We need more forgiveness, cooperation and faith these days.

      R J

    • Erin August 17, 2012 at 1:28 PM

      Hi John,

      I am Fred & Nina’s niece Erin. Would you please email me I have a couple of questions and maybe some insight.


  3. Pete May 22, 2012 at 1:08 AM

    Let me tell you about Fred and Nina’s expertise in the “debt” business. In early 2006 Fred began to perfect his “intel” by burning me for a meager $1500. He was using a company name Eagle Marketing Team and wanted to add my main product (Noni juice) to his wares. He made a few small purchases with us and promptly paid to gain our trust. Finally, he made a large purchase (well large for him, anyway). I extended him net 30 terms in the amount of $1500. At around 60 days I began to call and email him requesting payment. He hid from us and neglected to respond. Finally, he had his wife (Nina) respond to one of our emails. She took great pleasure in notifying us that they would not be paying their bill because they were unable to sell the product they bought from us. We offered her the option to return the product since they were stuck with it. She let us know in no uncertain terms that they never had any intention of honoring their debt and that we were officially burnt by them. Since it was a measly $1500, we did not bother to pursue them legally as through further investigation, they were hiding behind a P.O. box in Corona, California but had a Nevada corporation so they could easily skirt such debts. It was never the small amount of money that bothered me rather, it was the way he used his Christianity and devout love for Jesus Christ in ever conversation. He used his religion to try to gain trust with us so he could “morally” steal from us in a premeditated manner. He never allowed us to ship product to him and picked up each order from us so we would have no physical address on him. What’s worse is that he has half a dozen children and always had a few of them with him in his beat up minivan and brought them in tow to witness his thievery. So… As far as alleviating debt, Fred and Nina are experts. I am sure they can show people how to skirt their responsibilities and shirk their debts and they are apparently getting paid quite well for it! Only in America can you learn to steal and then sell the “technique” to others. I only wonder if Jesus will understand that Fred and Nina use him as a tool to further their gluttony when judgement day arrives.

  4. Erin August 17, 2012 at 1:35 PM


    I’m sorry to say this but when I was reading your blog here the first thing that popped up in my head was a red flag and the 2nd was SCAM. These people who are my Aunt and Uncle were the greatest people in the world when I was younger but as I grew older and listened to some of their BS they turned out not to be so great. There are plenty of people out their who have been scammed by them and most of our family has been at some point in time. But when it comes down to ripping your own mother off and letting your children mentally and physically abuse your mother there has to be a stopping point.

    Note to my Uncle Fred and Aunt Nina, and all of my cousins. Your day in court will come…. Just sayin’

  5. Trudee Smith August 18, 2012 at 10:29 PM

    Nina is my sister. I loved the little sister I once knew. The woman who has spent her entire life with Fred is not the sister I grew up with. These two hucksters have scammed money, housing, airline tickets and you name it from several people that I know of. The worst victim has got to be my mother. She lost her home, her car and $30k to these despicable people who convince people of their integrity by posing as patriots and Christians. I believe in truth and justice, and can only hope someone can bring these fugitives to their long overdue reckoning.

  6. RA August 28, 2012 at 12:53 PM

    We are trying to reach John Gutierrez. Is anyone warning the people hosting current/future seminars ?

    How do we get in touch with John?

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